Shimon Peres, minister of regional cooperation in the Barak
government, makes an impassioned plea for regional cooperation. He
stresses his conviction that only through economic and scientific
cooperation between Israel and its Arab neighbors is it possible to
modernize the region and to raise the standard of living of its
peoples, thus enabling the establishment of a lasting
peace.
Victor Cygielman: Do you share the fear of many Israelis that
there could be an outbreak of violence between Palestinians and
Israelis in the period ahead?
Shimon Peres: No doubt, in order to reduce tension between Israelis
and Palestinians, both parties must make a major effort not to lose
control of the situation. However, what causes tension is not
territorial proximity, but the enmity between the two parties. For
years, our border with Jordan between the Dead Sea and the Red Sea
has been peaceful. Jordanian Aqaba is a mere stone's throw from
Israeli Eilat. Nevertheless, all has been quiet there for over 50
years, even when there was no formal peace between the two
countries, because of cooperation and goodwill. This is how all the
borders should be. Minefields won't help. People must be able to
cross the borders freely, to trade, to visit each other. There is a
need for industrial parks, for common tourist projects, for joint
schools, etc., so as to create jobs and attract people.
One has the impression that you attach more importance to
regional cooperation and development than to the process of
peacemaking itself.
This is not true. What I say is that the two are intimately
connected and that a Middle East not integrated in the modern
global economy will stagnate, and ultimately its nations will go to
war again. There are two modern economies: the global and the
regional. The first knows no geographical boundaries, while the
second is connected to geography but not to state borders. Can a
border stop pollution, or divert the flow of rivers? Hence the need
for regional cooperation in order to create a modern regional
infrastructure benefiting all the peoples of the Middle East. The
problem is not only to make peace between the peoples, but make
peace for the region, facing a new era in a rapidly changing world.
Otherwise stagnation and poverty will endure. Nobody is going to
pay for the mistakes if we allow outdated concepts and ignorance to
prevail.
Economic and political experts in neighboring countries often
express concern that, under the guise of regional cooperation,
Israel is, in fact, seeking to control and dominate the economies
of the Middle East.
Nonsense! In many Arab countries there is no developed economy.
They have poverty. Who wants to control their poverty? We can't
control our own poverty and suddenly we are mad enough to want to
control the poverty of Egypt or Syria? Our interest is to develop,
to modernize the economies of all the countries in the region, for
as long as there is poverty, there will be wars. Regional
cooperation is the answer: thus water and electricity should be
jointly managed and shared, regardless of borders, otherwise they
become more expensive. Tourism is hampered by closed and mined
borders. Unless we change our approach, we shall continue to live
in a Middle East ruled by anachronistic concepts and regulations
that are stifling all progress. Look at the USA and Mexico. The US
economy is much more developed than the Mexican one. They joined
with Canada and opened everything up. Instead of bringing Mexican
workers to the USA, they brought US work to Mexico. This resulted
in better relations and improved the economic situation in
Mexico.
Likewise, Israeli manufacturers are transferring their textile
factories to Jordan and Egypt, because of the much cheaper Arab
labor. This increases unemployment in Israel.
In any case, competition from Asia is driving some Israeli textile
factories out of business. One has to adapt to change. Israeli
textile workers, even if they have reached the age of 40, should
learn new trades in order to join the modern work market. The key
is education. There is no future without education. This is as true
for Israel as for our Arab neighbors. I am for assisting the
Palestinian and Jordanian economies to reach higher technological
levels. They need a better standard of living. The Palestinians
have 52,000 students in eight universities. If those students, upon
graduation, don't find work, they'll start demonstrating against
Israel as well.
The editor in chief of the influential Egyptian daily Al-Ahram
has been highly critical of your book A New Middle East and has
taken exception to your statement that Egypt needs, and can
develop, a modern economy based on Saudi money, Egyptian labor and
Israeli know-how.
I never said that. What do those critics want? Yes, I support high
technology in Egypt. One can no longer make a living only from
agriculture. In a modern economy, agriculture goes down to 2
percent of the economy and tourism goes up to 12 percent. I state
my opinion freely on such matters and don't look for
compliments.
There is more money today in the world than ideas. Poverty in the
world is not so much a question of money as of ideas. Nowadays
machines are smarter than people and, without sufficient years of
study, one cannot operate the machines. Everyone will understand
this sooner or later.
In Israel it is a scandal that underpaid foreign workers results in
lower wages, unemployment and poverty among Israeli workers,
including Arab workers. Employers who do this should be taxed
accordingly.
Can you give some examples of projects of the Peres Center for
Peace?
Yes. We have 43 projects going. For example, in the field of health
we are engaged in optometry - testing eyes for defects - in five
centers: Morocco, Tunisia, Jordan, the Palestinian Authority and
Israel. We are involved in hi-tech in the region and have
established a joint $63-million Israeli-Palestinian investment
company to prepare Palestinian workers for hi-tech. Twenty-three
individual Israelis have invested $1 million, along with
Palestinian investments and World Bank loans. We are cooperating
with the Jordanians to build a center along the Jordan River for
fighting cancer, and a major investment will be the building of a
new joint hotel between Aqaba and Eilat, part of a new development
project called Jordan Gateway. Joint industrial parks have been
established in Karni and Jenin, and now we are planning a hi-tech
industrial park in Tulkarem. In the area of culture and sport, we
have set up a joint theater group and joint television programs
with the Palestinians. We even initiated a joint
Israeli-Palestinian soccer team that played in Italy this May
[2000] against an Italian/international team, watched by 80,000
people and attended by the greatest international soccer players
like Pele, as well as by Arafat and myself. All the proceeds went
to building electronic education centers in Palestinian and Israeli
schools.
Are you not afraid that the growth of religious fundamentalism
may put an end to the burgeoning cooperation?
The contrary is happening. Religious fanaticism is losing ground.
The Jewish, Christian, as well as the Muslim worlds are all
changing. The newly elected president of Indonesia, the largest
Muslim country in the world, visited Israel twice and is a member
of the board of directors of the Peres Center for Peace. There are
struggles to change things in Iran. We see the changes taking place
in Turkey and in Russia. None of this is enough, but it is
hopeful.
Science and technology don't wear uniforms. The region has to work
in this direction. The tragedy is that it is hard for people to
change their ancient opinions. The enmity among peoples exists in
the generation of the fathers. Why should the younger generation
repeat all the mistakes we made? Once people have an economy based
on brains and not on land, there will no longer be any need for
war.